@JustinJackFlash said:

@MrsBuckyBarnes said:

the problem with rand is that he was also an arse, but his back story undermined any justification for his conduct. yes, his parents were killed, but he was saved and taken in by monks who trained him for 15 years to attain excellence in terms of physical prowess, integrity and spirituality.

The show was however frequently suggesting that the monks' unwaveringly strict treatment of Rand was abuse. The show was suggesting Rand was suffering from PTSD.

i got that, but the show was also trying to suggest that he had been taught to confront, understand and govern his emotions, which actually should have helped him with his trauma. i thought this show was very inconsistent with the narrative and characterisation.

@MrsBuckyBarnes said:

How so? That's more or less what she went through. It informs her entire character. JJ was basically turned into an unwilling sex slave which you described as "not...wholly acceptable ".

for starters, your description of sexual assault was flippant and crass.

Says the person who totally minimized its important to the character. Granted we're talking about a fictional character but don't pretend like you're offended by my description because I didn't put a cute bow on it. Sexual assault is ugly no matter how it's described, grow up.

i think it would be fair to suggest that how each individual responds to trauma varies and consists of more than being a "little moody".

I was being factitious since you weren't taking that aspect of the character seriously. You said you found the character to be "intolerable, a pretty disgusting human being" completely ignoring the fact the character is dealing with her trauma in, my opinion, an interesting way for someone with superpowers. But yeah, ago ahead and clutch your pearls if that makes you feel better.

@MrsBuckyBarnes said:

How so? That's more or less what she went through. It informs her entire character. JJ was basically turned into an unwilling sex slave which you described as "not...wholly acceptable ".

for starters, your description of sexual assault was flippant and crass.

if you are wondering when did jj sexually abuse anyone, give some thought to the nature of her relationship with luke cage. then imagine what you would make of that relationship if the gender roles were reversed.

Two consenting adults using each other isn't abuse. JJ needed some validation, and Luke was still in love with Reeva. He wasn't ready to commit to anything. But he missed sexual contact with a female. This is purely adult relations.

The second part of your statement is perplexing as you seem to be saying either only men can be sexually abusive which then contradicts your original statement, or you're saying we can't recognize sexual abuse against other men.

@MrsBuckyBarnes said: the problem with rand is that he was also an arse, but his back story undermined any justification for his conduct. yes, his parents were killed, but he was saved and taken in by monks who trained him for 15 years to attain excellence in terms of physical prowess, integrity and spirituality. he should have been the most well rounded and centred person you could meet. instead, he abandoned his companions in kun-lun, leaving them in danger, and his impetuousness caused harm to his extended family in new york. when davos said danny rand destroys everything he touches, that was of course an exaggeration, but he kinda had a point. danny rand, as portrayed in this iron fist, is not someone i could like or respect.

I had to rewatch this series to understand something I missed first time round. And I am assuming what I'm about to describe is a concious choice by the writers: I believe the Danny Rand of this show is still a kid mentally speaking.

Like many other viewers I was having problems reconciling Danny's actions with his claims of being invincible and having incredible levels of self-control. The lines he's been given did not seem genuine, coming from him, and his actions proved time and again to be rash, and proof of a man not in control of his own impulses.

I think that the trauma of losing his family, combined with a harsh "upbringing" made him suffer some sort of ptsd( think of how often he thinks back to the defining moment of his life- the planecrash). He wasn't able to move on and grow into an adult like most of us do. Him lashing out, and losing self-control is just a symptom of the fact that he's still stuck in his childhood in many ways. Danny Rand doesn't exactly become an adult by the end of the show, but he reaches a higher level of maturity, then he had in the beginning.

His lines are still stupid and full of pseudo-philosophical ravings, his martial arts scenes are still clonky and unconvincing, but at least that would make it easier to understand some of his actions.

Personally I liked Ward and Joy quite well. I liked the boardroom/backroom machinations, and I thought Harold was quite a good villain (manipulative, brutal, cowardly, yet with one saving grace : his love for his daughter).

I really hope Finn Jones executes his martial arts in a more convincing manner in "the Defenders". Because in this series everybody and their neighbour was able to outshine him.

Nicely put, abaddonhades. I agree with a lot of what you said and you put into words what I was struggling to articulate with the whole ptsd thing.

And it's those sort of themes that are the reason I believe the hate for the show is exaggerated. What you describe doesn't sound like an awful show.

As I've said before, I quite liked it but admit it has it's flaws. But I find it hard to take the negativity toward the show seriously because it's so over the top.

If people said 'It's a bit iffy', ok, fair enough. If they made out it was rather average? Ok, I can swallow that. But people talk about the show like it was such an abhorrent experience it gave them ptsd.

Problems with this show

1. Colleen Wing

2. Iron Fist getting his butt kicked by everyone I assume if he tried to snatch candy from a baby it would not end well for him.

Personally I liked Ward and Joy quite well. I liked the boardroom/backroom machinations, and I thought Harold was quite a good villain (manipulative, brutal, cowardly, yet with one saving grace : his love for his daughter).

i really liked ward too. i've heard the second season is much better, but i disliked the first one so much that i can't drum up any enthusiasm to watch it. hopefully that will change one day.