UFO, Space: Above And Beyond, The Starlost....

UFO episode 1 (pre-set to avoid spoilers): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q1XOacWCbuo&t=78s

Space: Above And Beyond pilot: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6CNjJoEUxwA

The Starlost, episode 1 (pre-set to avoid spoilers): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l_Kv0VlJvNQ&t=174s

I wanted to like this BUT, there would be a good episode then 2 or 3 crappy ones, then a good one & then...?

You mean Enterprise? It was definitely hit-and-miss.

I thought it was a mistake to do the retcon to start with, where the Vulcans already had warp drive for maybe centuries. I think it was pretty clear from the TOS episode "Metamorphosis" that Zefram Cochrane invented/discovered warp drive not just for Earth, but for EVERYONE.

@Knixon said:

You mean Enterprise? It was definitely hit-and-miss.

I thought it was a mistake to do the retcon to start with, where the Vulcans already had warp drive for maybe centuries. I think it was pretty clear from the TOS episode "Metamorphosis" that Zefram Cochrane invented/discovered warp drive not just for Earth, but for EVERYONE.

Isn't that what we are commenting on?

On the series overall, maybe so. But they could have kept with the TOS history for the new show, maybe show Cochrane inventing warp drive and then showing their first visits to Vulcan and elsewhere.

The retcon actually began with the First Contact movie, which was also a mistake.

In TOS Cochrane was described as "of (from) Alpha Centauri?" Which suggests that Cochrane was an early colonist or maybe was born on the already-existing colony. Maybe on a voyage between there and Earth, he did an experiment in interstellar space to test a theory that could not be tested anywhere near a "gravity well" such as a star or even a planet. Which could also explain why nobody else did it first - or at least not successfully - because it may be that other inhabited systems/planets are much farther from their nearest neighbor star, or at least one with habitable planets, so that they never bothered to go there sub-light which might take a lot longer than it would for us. And that would mean no experiments in between for them to discover warp drive.

And when you think about it, from their primitive/violent history and usual belief in isolation etc, it makes no sense that the Vulcans would have invented warp drive. Why would they?

I didn't watch the original, too hokey! I didn't start watching until TNG, liked it for the most part. DS9 was just meh? Loved Voyager though.

TOS may need to be watched more with the 1960s in mind. That was easy for me since I grew up then. It's different from current TV in several ways, because of how things were done back then. The idea of endless repeats etc, especially FIFTY YEARS LATER! was just nonsense. That and other factors - few shows had "arcs" then, etc - all make it more difficult for "modern" people to appreciate.

I also grew up during the 70s so I didn't think UFO or The Starlost were ridiculous and I can still have that mindset when I watch it now. That said, there were a good share of TOS episodes that don't have the same problems as others. I could probably make a good list if I sat down and thought about it for a while.

If you saw all of DS9 - not like just part of season 1 and gave up, because it was a bit slow getting started - and still thought "meh," you're probably beyond help. In terms of ridiculous episodes, Voyager probably outdid TOS. Janeway and Paris turn into salamanders and have sex? Please. And I might argue that all the holo-life crap in Voyager was more ridiculous than anything in TOS.

@Knixon said:

TOS may need to be watched more with the 1960s in mind. That was easy for me since I grew up then. It's different from current TV in several ways, because of how things were done back then. The idea of endless repeats etc, especially FIFTY YEARS LATER! was just nonsense. That and other factors - few shows had "arcs" then, etc - all make it more difficult for "modern" people to appreciate.

I also grew up during the 70s so I didn't think UFO or The Starlost were ridiculous and I can still have that mindset when I watch it now. That said, there were a good share of TOS episodes that don't have the same problems as others. I could probably make a good list if I sat down and thought about it for a while.

If you saw all of DS9 - not like just part of season 1 and gave up, because it was a bit slow getting started - and still thought "meh," you're probably beyond help. In terms of ridiculous episodes, Voyager probably outdid TOS. Janeway and Paris turn into salamanders and have sex? Please. And I might argue that all the holo-life crap in Voyager was more ridiculous than anything in TOS.

I'm more & likely older than you, I was born in 1953. I also didn't like early Doctor Who (liked starting with the 9th Doctor). I stopped watching DS9 around season 6, the war with the Dominion just got to be too much? I also didn't really have a lot of time to watch it work, etc. I never said that Voyager didn't have some ridiculous episodes, of course, it did. But...?

You know insulting somebody because they do not like something you do isn't very polite! Different strokes!

different strokes different folks