this show is terrible.

I will have to agree with both of you in some degree Wolf359 and A to Z (and ocelot11snake).

We could advocate that Colleen Wing (Jessica Henwick ) is a really well trained martial arts specialist and that she could take on 2 really strong fighters on her own.

Wolf359 -

That skinny little girl beating up 2 big body builders in the ring without superpowers ? give me a break.

A to Z -

But Daredevil beating up 10 guys in a corridor you find realistic? Give me a break. This is fantasy.

It is all fantasy of course, there is a level or degree of realism which the creators have to make these characters exist... they create a world and we either we tag along and have fun in this world or we complain about everything that "Can't be real!" when we compare it with reality (if we believe superman can fly we can have some fun when he saves people from falling from a building, etc... when superman makes the earth go backwards and time rewinds... eh.. 'for some' that might be stretching it a bit).

So for example a "skinny little girl beating up 2 big body builders in the ring without superpowers" is something that in the world of marvel superheroes... I could say that it can happen.

BUT... my issue with the show is basically that I don't feel they choreographed most of the action scenes well, and in turn... they really didn't sell this fictional world they want us to live in.

So in the cage fight scene with the 2 strong fighters versus the little girl, my issue wasn't really that she's in real life a "skinny little girl" and couldn't beat two strong guys, my issue was that in the show she didn't really sell me the idea that she is trained enough to beat those two guys, the illusion wasn't really there (very slow movements, lack of quasi believable moves that took weight interaction as something of importance, etc).

I mean even within the Marvel Cinematic Universe we could find examples where a woman like Scarlet Jo. fights lots of guys and I didn't really have an issue, because they sold the action better (faster movements and other tricks like non continuous shots where they swap into a stunt woman to convey some cool moves, etc).

So yeah a highly trained skinny girl could beat 2 strong fighters in a ring in the Ironfist world, but I just wasn't sold that idea in that scene.

My issue isn't really just that scene, its pretty much most of the fighting in the show isn't really well done. Even a lot of the situations aren't well thought or consistent (for the characters to overcome/solve them).

Regarding Daredevil (sure within that world he has a "really awesome" and specialty crafted helm and suit too) the fights were well choreographed and executed (for the most part)... it really isn't the fact that he is a guy or a girl (in this fictional world) that makes me believe he can fight 10 guys or more.

Finn Jones' fighting scenes were pretty good, on the other hand Jessica Henwick had quite a few where I literally had my eyes rolling. She's really not convincing as a martial artist, let alone a master.

To be honest it was on the level of DD season 2, good but not great.

@vicky_lc2001 said:

You're just supposed to accept some non-powered girl can defeat those 2 trained ring men.

Which is a dumb move from the producers. I guess they think "Hey, DC does it, they have skinny little women beating up much bigger, trained soldiers / special forces equipped with helmet and kevlar every week in Arrow or Legends Of Tomorrow and people keep watching. why shouldn't we do it?"

My best guess is there some feminist agenda going on among Hollywood producers.

TBH I'm still watching those shows as well, and I don't know why.

Perhaps they should've focused on her fighting style, perhaps her exceptional speed and know how on body points helped her defeat them- but they did none of that.

... he had to learn a woman's kung fu to defeat the enemy. ...

I guess you're talking about Wing Chun, which was to my knowledge developed by a woman. Also it targets the weakest body parts like throat, knee etc. and the goal is knockout or even kill as fast as possible.

That skinny little woman did punch the bigger guy to his weak spots (and Danny healed her hand in the dojo scene). But she was also wrestling with that dude on the ground, trying to dislocate his arm, which was very unbelievable, with that size of biceps he could have ragdolled her like Hulk did to Loki.

@pkdrdoom said:

So for example a "skinny little girl beating up 2 big body builders in the ring without superpowers" is something that in the world of marvel superheroes... I could say that it can happen. BUT... my issue with the show is basically that I don't feel they choreographed most of the action scenes well, and in turn... they really didn't sell this fictional world they want us to live in.

I mean even within the Marvel Cinematic Universe we could find examples where a woman like Scarlet Jo. fights lots of guys

Regarding Daredevil (sure within that world he has a "really awesome" and specialty crafted helm and suit too) the fights were well choreographed and executed (for the most part)... it really isn't the fact that he is a guy or a girl (in this fictional world) that makes me believe he can fight 10 guys or more.

I agree with all the points you make. A good superhero action scene is one where the viewers don't have to think "can't be real".

Superman's time travel is a good example.

Another one is Captain America holding down the helicopter.

or Spiderman throwing that football across the field and bending the pole.

Or when ScarJo is thrown inside a tank with a grenade, and she kicks the guy with a helmet, knocks him out and uses him as a shield. A normal person should not be able to knock out someone with a helmet simply by kicking the helmet.

Also, in the Spiderman Homecoming trailer, the scene where spiderman holds that ship together, the unbelievable part is not spiderman's strength (he is really strong) or the web (which is also very strong) but the parts of the ship the web is attached to, those parts aren't strong enough to hold the ship together.

Those G-forces should kill Tony Stark, but that's ok, it's a superhero movie. Those Ironman scenes always look good.

So there's a fine line the producers shouldn't overstep when making superhero shows or moview.