Lots of people have never seen Gilbert and Sullivan, or Original Star Trek, or even Buffy and Hercules for that matter.

@CharlesTheBold said:

I've seen this storyline half of a dozen times. Gilbert and Sullivan did it Original Trek did it, Buffy did it 3 times.

Hercules' Legendary Journeys even included the subplot of enemy ambassadors reconciled via the lovespell, so I guessed the ending half an hour ahead.

Don't do anything so hackneyed again.

Hey Chuck, I don't think TPTB are going to see this?

Even if they did see it, what's really the point? Lots of people who see The Orville will not have seen the other shows, and not just because they were decades ago. Often the types of interest don't even coincide. Which is why I haven't seen - and won't ever see - Hercules or Xena, for example.

But even for people who've seen them all, is that some reason to not use similar plots again? Should Buffy have never been made, let alone the various Draculas and everything else similar, just because Nosferatu was made in 1922?

I have less of a problem with plot recycling or whatever you want to call it, in terms of the wider public audience, than with something like the 2-part episode of JAG that basically re-used the plot of "Witness For The Prosecution" while nobody in the show realized it. Now, it's not difficult to argue or believe that most people who watched JAG even "religiously" may never have seen "Witness..." but I don't believe for a minute that the highly-competent lawyer characters in the SHOW never saw it. It should have been written so at least one of the characters makes a reference to it somehow. Maybe even just Admiral Chegwidden at the end. I think it would have been more realistic for a show about lawyers, and it might have gotten some people to look at the movie.

Yes, I saw the JAG episode that copied WITNESS FOR THE PROSECUTION, and I disliked it for the same reason. It's irritating when I know what's going to happen every minute of an episode because I've seen the original version of the story. ( I guess I might add that I'm 62 and I've seen a lot of television)

It's better when the later writer acknowledges his source. For example, one of the big subplots on BABYLON 5 was based on a 1950s novel called the DEMOLISHED MAN by Alfred Bester. So one of the main characters in that sequence was named Alfred Bester. And as you said, one of the lawyers on JAG should have thought of "Witness for the Prosecution", and made a reference.

I'll admit I figured it might be pheramones, and I figured they'd use those pheramones to get the two warring aliens to make nice somehow, and I have seen other sci-fi shows that have using the "everybody falls in love with everybody else" plot.

That said, this was by far the funniest episode of The Orville so far. I was surprised at just how far they took the premise. I was expecting Kelly to walk in and find Ed and Darulio in bed and then he squirts blue, but luckily they didn't do that obvious reversal joke.

I also like how Darulio implied this may have been why Kelly cheated on Ed with him, though I think his pheramones weren't actually the cause, but he's just a nice guy giving them a reason to reconcile.

Just finished watching the latest episode. Really didn't like it. If this had been one of the first couple of episodes I wouldn't have continued watching.

@CharlesTheBold said:

It's better when the later writer acknowledges his source. For example, one of the big subplots on BABYLON 5 was based on a 1950s novel called the DEMOLISHED MAN by Alfred Bester. So one of the main characters in that sequence was named Alfred Bester. And as you said, one of the lawyers on JAG should have thought of "Witness for the Prosecution", and made a reference.

I believe we've covered this before in the B5 section, the Bester character on B5 might have been officially named Alfred, but I don't believe he was referred to in the show as anything but Al.

@CharlesTheBold said:

Yes, I saw the JAG episode that copied WITNESS FOR THE PROSECUTION, and I disliked it for the same reason. It's irritating when I know what's going to happen every minute of an episode because I've seen the original version of the story. ( I guess I might add that I'm 62 and I've seen a lot of television)

For the JAG episode(s) it might even have been sufficient if Chegwidden had shown up at the end, and upon hearing how the case went, he chuckles and says "Witness For The Prosecution, Charles Laughton, 1957." The others look at him puzzled, and then head for Blockbuster... (which I think still existed when that episode aired). But I really can't believe that the highly competent lawyers portrayed on the show wouldn't have seen it already, except perhaps for Brumby from Down Under. Which might have created an opening for the other characters explaining the film to HIM. Heck they could even say that the US sailor who committed the crime had seen the movie and, figuring the Aussies wouldn't be familiar with it, decided to use that plot for his crime... Although in that case he wouldn't have requested a US lawyer, and might have tried to object when the Aussie government decided to bring them in. It might have been more complicated and taken more time, but they had two parts and they could have gotten rid of some things to make room if needed, such as Bud getting his jaw broken...

Incidentally, WITNESS was remade in the 1970s, with Diana Rigg ( GAME OF THRONES) and Ralph Richardson.

I don't know how well the story is known in various countries. Since it deals with a clever criminal manipulating the English court system, I wonder if it might even be shown and discussed in law schools.

Diana Rigg's big credit now is "Game Of Thrones?" That's funny.

I've seen Diana Rigg in tons of things -- The Avengers, Dickens' Bleak House, the musical "A Little Night Music", movie King Lear opposite Lawrence Olivier. I mentioned "Game of Thrones" because that's what younger audiences would associate her with.

@cswood said:

I'll admit I figured it might be pheramones, and I figured they'd use those pheramones to get the two warring aliens to make nice somehow, and I have seen other sci-fi shows that have using the "everybody falls in love with everybody else" plot.

I was expecting an orgy at the climax but was sadly disappointed. Also, Seth Mcfarlain already did the skit of a husband and wife attracted to and sleeping with the same guy in Family Guy (Bill Clinton), this episode kept reminding me of it.

@CharlesTheBold said:

I've seen this storyline half of a dozen times. Gilbert and Sullivan did it Original Trek did it, Buffy did it 3 times.

Hercules' Legendary Journeys even included the subplot of enemy ambassadors reconciled via the lovespell, so I guessed the ending half an hour ahead.

Don't do anything so hackneyed again.

Is this the first episode of The Orville you've seen?

The whole point of this show is spoofing sci-fi and TV tropes. A lot of everything you see in the show has been done before. So Seth MacFarlane is making a show both spoofing and paying tribute to the tropes of sci-fi that he, and every sci-fi fan, loves.

The robot hitting on the female security chief (done in ST: TNG) (Tasha Yar and Data) Crew goes to planet and accidentally breaks one of their laws and one member of the crew ends up in jail (Wesley Crusher in ST:TNG, season 1, episode 8, Justice)

Etc.

Ill admit that this isn't the most original episode. But from a comedy point of view. It worked for me.